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Sunny
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:39 pm

OK... Tried on Moon. I kept my hand just above my head so she could tell that it wasn't meant for her.

Thanks for the advice.

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Sunny
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:57 pm

Hi Suman,

I think a lot of people(especially me) are still struggling with our double turns. Is there any tricks to make yourself turn more and smoother Normally I can do my 1.5 turns but when I try doing double turns, I lose balance even b4 the 1.5 mark.

What sort of training, pactice methods do you propose?

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Moon
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Mon Dec 18, 2006 1:00 pm

me too... i can do double turn with "pedalling" and with partner. but i cant do any double turn at all when im doing it on my own. suman pls help..
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Christina Lim
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Mon Dec 18, 2006 1:07 pm

sigh... moon, whatever you have, make it 2 cuz i have exactly the same problem! Sad
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suman
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:07 pm

Firstly Spinning is something that is not really achieveable overnight. So dont get disheartened, the good thing is that you guys are trying and I am sure with the correct technique you will achieve it sooner or later.

In a nutshell spinning gets better only when you know your own body dynamics better. To know your own body dynamics better make sure you are doing a lot more warm ups that help you get thru to this and not just spinning any how.

Some of the warm ups that I teach in pre intermediate:
Chene turns (1,2 and 3)
half pivot turns
spots
single spins left and right

Infact the whole pre intermediate session focusses in spinning and strictly spinning. Remember salsa technique and ballet technique of spinning are different.

Some of the ground rules that you need to observe for the salsa technique are the following.

1. Unlock knees
2. Straighten spinal chord
3. Chest up
4. Keep the momentum on the same plane
5. Distribute body weight evenly during take off
6. Spot

Spinning is an art that is easily said and explained than done, its like building a muscle everyone can tell you what weight to use and how much to use and which machine to work on but to build it is something that can only be achieved with regular practice of the above mentioned.

Different between ladies and mens technique:

I could write an essay on this but to make it short and easy men make sure you focuss on the hook turns more and the forward step spins. Women make sure that you focus on the "prep". The prep is like a take off for a plane, if your prep is incorrect then you may lose balance again and again and you may have to rely on the guy too much. So work hard on the prep.

You only know you have achieved the technique when you stop pedalling and start spinning on one momentum.

Guys when you are spinning the ladies, make sure that you setting the crown in the correct plane. Keep your arms locked, keep the speed and pace correct. Crown properly and do not pivot fingers above the head. Prep them on time and do not disbalance them during the prep.

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Last edited by on Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Christina Lim
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:38 pm

wow! Many thanks Suman! thank you for your patient with us and a very clear and succinct explaination about spinning techniques Smile With this, im sure we can make a more conscious efforts when executing our footwork and spins. hopefully, we make gradual improvement over time Smile

thank you once again, Suman! you have been a great blessing to many of us Smile
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suman
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:53 pm

You are welcome Smile What ever it takes to make a good dancer Smile

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Danielle
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:54 am

Hi Suman,

Been practicing my spinnin and i have got a question to add on to Sunny and Moon's earlier query.

I think i can roughly make it through 1.5 or 2 spins without losing balance in between. However, the problem of inbalance comes in esp when i am trying to stop.
Either i overspin to face slightly away from the front(my partner's) direction or i lose balance trying to stop and have to put out one foot out to balance. Stopping after one spin is still ok prob becos the speed is slower but stopping after multiple spins at faster speeds is terrible for me. I will always lose the beat after that trying to balance.

Is it becos i am not spotting enuff or i am not spinning correctly? Do you have any tips to stop properly after multiple turns by myself or with a partner (esp when i dunno when he wants me to stop and face which direction?)?
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:57 am

Hi Suman,

I would like to tap on the spinning question too. My problem differs from Danielle's - Sometimes when i do managed to execute a pretty decent and balanced spin, i realised that I dun have enough 'momentum' to spin a complete 2 rounds. Any additional effort to spins 'harder' in an attempt to get enough momentum is always futile.

I am wondering how can i draw enough momentum for spins without pedaling.

Thank you for your time and guidance in attending to our questions Smile

santa Merry Christmas santa


Cheerios,
rendeer chrissy rendeer
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suman
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Mon Dec 25, 2006 3:46 am

Danielle,

let me first clear out some misconceptions, or rather let me make some assumptions before i start talking,

First: Stopping at the right beat after multiple spins is a leaders job and not a followers. If you are a leader and are trying to do multiple spin then stop a count earlier.

For example a very common turn pattern where guys do multiple spins is after an enchuflae, situations like this it is very important that you keep your spins in half a bar or four counts, for example you open break on 1 execute the encuflae and then step for the hook on the right leg for the leader and then execute a few hook turns. This hook happens on 5 and the spins finish by 6 7 8. if you are not really sure of the count always make it a point to finish it a little earlier like by 7 so that you have a count to breathe, once you master this then you can proceed to pin on the edge.

Spotting helps with the giddiness and makes you look good, but not that much with the stopping, keep your toes together, bring down your heels sharp when you want to stop. unlock knees and make sure they are a little bent, if you are losing balance bend a little more lower, you the physics about the center of gravity and metacenter crap, basically thats what comes into play.

Now, I foresee a much more bigger problem in the following question:

Do you have any tips to stop properly after multiple turns by myself or with a partner (esp when i dunno when he wants me to stop and face which direction?)?

From this i gather that if you are a follower your leader is not really giving the right signal to stop. He is not slowing down the momentum at the right time and probably not crowning your correctly. He is also probably not stabilizing you at the right count. This is again a whole new world of problems which I think is for the leader to understand.

There is so much to explain for both sides of the spinning that I think words may not be enough. I hope i have been able to answer your questions above. Since i see quite a few people having spinning problems, let me know if you and your friends need a workshop on that, pls dont get me wrong i am not trying to sell my class or something, its just that there are so many things that are best demonstrated than written, neverthless I will continue to explain as much as i can.

Most importantly, like i said as a follower remember to keep your toes together when you are spinning and shoulders locked with soft arms. When you see the arms of the leader coming down, bring your heels down and knees down too.

Hope this helps.


Christina,

Your question is easy to answer but a litlte difficult to implement in reality. First, we all know that for taking a momentum for right spins we shift our cage to the left, now shifting to the left does not necessarily mean greater momentum and more spins, a lady can only take so much momentum to do 4 to 5 spins on her own at an advanced level, if you can do 2, you are ready to get into the multiple spin mode by the guy.

This is how it works theoretically, for the first two spins the momentum and stability totally comes from the lady, from the 2.5 to 3rd spin onwards the guy takes over, the effect the guy feels is like churning a big log of wood with a handle to hold on top, in other words the lady has to really really stiffen her ab muscles, bend knees and do all the other necessary stuff reqd for getting into the multiple spin mode. Ofcourse from here on a large portion of the job totally depends on keeping balance too. As for the leaders, it is really very very important to focus on crowining the lady and ensuring the every crown is so perfect that she NEVER gets disbalanced, this is a very delicate tension, too much can sprain the guys fingers too little can disbalance the lady, something that again takes time and lot of practice to achieve.

Merry Spinning Christmas!


PS: Just a note to all those who are interested in the clean up workshop please ensure that you are registered for the workshop.

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Danielle
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Thu Dec 28, 2006 8:40 am

Hi Suman,

Took me some time digesting your reply. thanks for the time taken man!
I guess when i asked the question, i was thinking it was my own fault.
Becuase when we are practicing on our own in class, i can't seem to keep my balance at the end also.

Guess i really need that spinning workshop.
Will you be covering that in your coming "Clean=up" workshop?
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suman
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:36 pm

Ha ha ha .. hope you finally managed to digest it! Ya probably i should have started my approach mentioning whether it was solo or partner.

well i am not sure depends on the time available .. in the clean up workshop i will be starting from the majority problems given to me with higher priority and then move to the ones with lesser votes or lower priority. If i have time i will surely cover whatever you guys ask for. I mean this is more like a "Private" Workshop so will follow whatever you guys decide in a majority. I have have my own routine check up on the basics clean up but after that it will be pretty much your requests. A suggestion to all you guys is to ensure that you have in mind clearly what problems you are facing currently when dancing and what you would like to clean up.

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Christina Lim
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:47 pm

Hi Suman,

Thank you for the reply.

I think i will have to come back to 'digest' your reply on another day. I have been busy and now getting ill (prob from the lack of rest and me getting caught in bits of rain every now and then).

Hope you had a wonderful Xmas and may the new year ahead be a better one for you Smile

Cheerios,
Christina
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Sunny
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:18 pm

Hi Suman,

Now I can turn 2 rounds without stopping. However, I am turning very slow and if the tempo of the song is faster, I wouldn't be able to cpmplete my double turn. I have tried turning faster by using slightly more force but that would throw me off balance and is counter productive instead. What do you recommend to turn faster and yet stable?

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suman
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:47 am

Sunny,

To make spinning look fast you can only give an impression, fast spinning does not come from extra force that you have already realised, a major impression of people spinning fast comes from spotting, if you spotting is clean without your body stumbling then you give a good impression, which is sort of a slightly cheat technique.

The proper way to do it would be to ensure that you really hold your body tight in within, which means you really crunch your stomach muscles but keep your cage relaxed.

Keep your feet together, pivot your cage and the whole upper body on the same axis and dont give it a cyclone or tornado effect. Practicing this again and again could give you a way better speed. Remember sometimes adding a hook or two makes it look like a seamless multiple spin, so thats something very important for men.

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Sunny
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PostSubject: Re: Ask Suman   Fri Jan 26, 2007 7:17 am

ok.... thanks so much for your advice

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